If President of the United States can try to take down the country and still be walking around a free man, thinking about running again, why should anything matter all? We allow ourselves to be lied to and we keep going back for more as we keep putting people back in office who lie to us. That includes even the good people. Perhaps we like being lied to because in those lies we find hope. Or perhaps it’s just a matter of which lie we wanna believe in. I just don’t know.
Lucian, you make a strong case that the CIA operatives in Kabul and elsewhere in Afghanistan were imbued with the spirit of Sergeant Schultz, he of Hogan's Heroes, who appeared to have only one line to say in any of the episodes: "I know nothing!" More likely, what we had is a paraphrase of something a German concentration camp guard said to one of the inmates after being asked "Why?". Of course this was all in German, but the camp guard's response has been preserved for all time: "Es gibt kein Warum hier." Translation: "There is no 'why' here." What you describe is the absence of 'why'. What you're also describing is a fortress mentality like the one we had in Iraq, and earlier in Saigon. The idea was to let nothing get through the barriers, and that apparently included military intelligence and cognitive intelligence as well.
HUBRIS Most great empires believe the stories they tell themselves about their invincibility. Did we learn from Russian hubris in Afghanistan? No Did we learn from the hubris of the 1000 year Reich? Or, the French security of the invincible Maginot Line? Were the commanders snoozing through history classes at West Point? Why should American Exceptionalism be anything other than a common form of human delusion?
Looking at the photo you posted, I was reminded of our exodus from RVN. The parallels are many. I’m thinking that RVN was an “intelligence” dry run for Afghanistan - a really long haul. Nothing accomplished other than to make some contractors terribly wealthy, kill a few of our troops, and more of the indigenous folks, and employ lots of intell guys and provide careers for lots of military types…
We lost the war because we haven't learned from our own history that the people of a country don't like people from another country trying to take over their land and tell them what to do. The American Revolution came about because Britain tried to run North America from London, and thought they could over power the Patriots. Instead the Patriots set up a shadow government, the Continental Congress, and ran a parallel government that reflected the views of the people. Over and over the British tried the same tactics we tried in Viet Nam and they didn't work. Reading about the revolution in the south sounds like Viet Nam. Establish strong points, send out punitive raids, threaten the population-didn't work then and won't work anywhere else. People don't like foreigners pushing them around. One of our country's most brilliant generals, Nathaniel Green, utilized main force troops-the Maryland Continental Line- with ad hoc militia formations to bewilder and defeat Cornwallis, while losing most of the battles he fought. Sadly we have forgotten this lesson and our political leaders persist in acting like Parliament in the eighteenth century. I can recommend the book The Road to Guilford Courthouse, by John Buchanan as a well written, and very readable history of the Revolution in the South.
Children, dartboards, monkeys could do far better. As the British proved during their colonial period, the only worthwhile intelligence came form people living amongst the "natives" How can we be such fools? Also, I would bet the were some lower level, very bright people generating accurate intel. They were ignored because it did not fit the narrative.
Bureaucrats have a habit of self preservation, evading unpleasant truths. No one at CIA believed Afghanistan was tenable or Iraq, they knew from day on that both wars were playthings for Cheney and Rumsfeld. It is a sad truth that President Obama as good as he was feared the wrath of gasbags in congress if he got serious about victory in either country. Trump for all his tacky bluster understood what the truth was. His feckless exit plan was self serving. Why President Biden endorsed even part of it is tragic. Afghanistan will never become anything until all the Afghans get together and work on their future. Afghan women must stop waiting for outside help, they must get serious and fight for their rights. America must stop thinking that CIA and their toys can save us.
The other tipoff was one American Army officer (I think) talking about how much he liked the Indian cook on his base. So they weren't even hiring local people to do routine jobs around the base, but bringing in people from other countries. The rampant corruption of the Afghan government and military wasn't enough for the Afghan people to put up with, they couldn't even get jobs on the Yank bases.
If President of the United States can try to take down the country and still be walking around a free man, thinking about running again, why should anything matter all? We allow ourselves to be lied to and we keep going back for more as we keep putting people back in office who lie to us. That includes even the good people. Perhaps we like being lied to because in those lies we find hope. Or perhaps it’s just a matter of which lie we wanna believe in. I just don’t know.
Lucian, you make a strong case that the CIA operatives in Kabul and elsewhere in Afghanistan were imbued with the spirit of Sergeant Schultz, he of Hogan's Heroes, who appeared to have only one line to say in any of the episodes: "I know nothing!" More likely, what we had is a paraphrase of something a German concentration camp guard said to one of the inmates after being asked "Why?". Of course this was all in German, but the camp guard's response has been preserved for all time: "Es gibt kein Warum hier." Translation: "There is no 'why' here." What you describe is the absence of 'why'. What you're also describing is a fortress mentality like the one we had in Iraq, and earlier in Saigon. The idea was to let nothing get through the barriers, and that apparently included military intelligence and cognitive intelligence as well.
HUBRIS Most great empires believe the stories they tell themselves about their invincibility. Did we learn from Russian hubris in Afghanistan? No Did we learn from the hubris of the 1000 year Reich? Or, the French security of the invincible Maginot Line? Were the commanders snoozing through history classes at West Point? Why should American Exceptionalism be anything other than a common form of human delusion?
Great article; mebbe we should nix the dept. of redundancy dept.?
Seems to be a lot of them, lately.
Looking at the photo you posted, I was reminded of our exodus from RVN. The parallels are many. I’m thinking that RVN was an “intelligence” dry run for Afghanistan - a really long haul. Nothing accomplished other than to make some contractors terribly wealthy, kill a few of our troops, and more of the indigenous folks, and employ lots of intell guys and provide careers for lots of military types…
Victory or defeat is irrelevant so long as the War Machine is fed…sadly!
We lost the war because we haven't learned from our own history that the people of a country don't like people from another country trying to take over their land and tell them what to do. The American Revolution came about because Britain tried to run North America from London, and thought they could over power the Patriots. Instead the Patriots set up a shadow government, the Continental Congress, and ran a parallel government that reflected the views of the people. Over and over the British tried the same tactics we tried in Viet Nam and they didn't work. Reading about the revolution in the south sounds like Viet Nam. Establish strong points, send out punitive raids, threaten the population-didn't work then and won't work anywhere else. People don't like foreigners pushing them around. One of our country's most brilliant generals, Nathaniel Green, utilized main force troops-the Maryland Continental Line- with ad hoc militia formations to bewilder and defeat Cornwallis, while losing most of the battles he fought. Sadly we have forgotten this lesson and our political leaders persist in acting like Parliament in the eighteenth century. I can recommend the book The Road to Guilford Courthouse, by John Buchanan as a well written, and very readable history of the Revolution in the South.
Children, dartboards, monkeys could do far better. As the British proved during their colonial period, the only worthwhile intelligence came form people living amongst the "natives" How can we be such fools? Also, I would bet the were some lower level, very bright people generating accurate intel. They were ignored because it did not fit the narrative.
Bureaucrats have a habit of self preservation, evading unpleasant truths. No one at CIA believed Afghanistan was tenable or Iraq, they knew from day on that both wars were playthings for Cheney and Rumsfeld. It is a sad truth that President Obama as good as he was feared the wrath of gasbags in congress if he got serious about victory in either country. Trump for all his tacky bluster understood what the truth was. His feckless exit plan was self serving. Why President Biden endorsed even part of it is tragic. Afghanistan will never become anything until all the Afghans get together and work on their future. Afghan women must stop waiting for outside help, they must get serious and fight for their rights. America must stop thinking that CIA and their toys can save us.
The other tipoff was one American Army officer (I think) talking about how much he liked the Indian cook on his base. So they weren't even hiring local people to do routine jobs around the base, but bringing in people from other countries. The rampant corruption of the Afghan government and military wasn't enough for the Afghan people to put up with, they couldn't even get jobs on the Yank bases.
Saint Peter don't you call me 'cause I can't goooooo, I lost that war to the Taliban-oooooo
Hard questions and no answers. Thanks for provoking thought!
My opponents who live in the Right Wing news bubble will never read what is here.
Trump says it's all Joe's fault, that is their reality...great effort,, but no cigar, sadly.