Broken is the word used most often these days to describe the United States Senate. The greatest deliberative body in the world can’t get anything done because of obscure rules and traditions, including the filibuster, which can be invoked at any time by any Senator to stymie movement of bills and appointments to a vote, either in committee or on the floor.
"[McConnell] will.... go about the business of overturning every law passed by Democrats in the last 50 years beginning with Obamacare and going right through improvements in the areas of immigration, voting rights, campaign finance…anything with Democratic fingerprints on it...."
Will somebody PLEASE tell me something positive that the GOP is FOR?
All I see and hear is about destroying things. They want to: destroy abortion rights, destroy birth control, destroy sex education, destroy civil rights for minorities, destroy civil rights for homosexuals, destroy voting rights, destroy public education, destroy science, destroy the teaching of history, destroy unions, destroy environmental protections, destroy the IRS, destroy Medicaid, destroy Medicare, destroy Social Security, destroy gun control laws....have I left out anything else that the GOP wants to destroy? Assuming they were to succeed at all or most of these goals, what kind of a society to they envision? I would really like to know.
So well said. We are fighting the dark forces. The Jews must have felt the same way as the Nazi party gained power. Any good Republicans have been vanquished. afraid to speak out for fear of retribution.
Daughter of Holocaust victims here. Yes, they were terrified as I am now. The question is: What does TFG (the former guy) have on these Republicans? They are silent as lambs and that's what is worrying me.
Marlene Lerner Bigley, so sad for your family. What the Nazi's did to the Jews and those they considered enemies of the state is incomprehensible, even animals kill only for food for the most part, not out of hatred and envy. We think think no American government would ever ever do anything even close to that but I believe that if Trump ever got in power again he and his inner circle would be emboldened and who knows what they might do. We must pass that voting rights act. I don't think Manchin and Sinema and some others have a clue as to the danger we are in. They are in a world of the past, The radical faction of the GOP have taken over, they even praised the frenzied mob that attacked the Capitol as patriots. Trump was watching it all unfold with glee. I'm sure he would have continued to watch had they actually hanged him.
Thank you, Bob. Manchenema are both strange Democrats. I do, in fact, think that they absolutely do know what consequences we will be in for if the GOP is successful. It appears they are easily swayed by the almighty dollar. Sinema used to be a darling among progressives. Once she was in Congress, she has turned a blind eye to the ideals of the people she represents. Manchin is supposedly a “nice guy” but he is sorely out of touch with his constituents. He is, after all, an owner of a coal mine so he is a very wealthy white businessman whose workers are being killed by black lung disease. He and Sinema are simply jerks as they have repeatedly given us the middle finger.
money (yes, it amazes me as well that people can get so insanely destructive for just money, but maybe I don't understand because I've never had any) and "power" (inverted commas because, like many other people, I don't think they actually know what it is or what to do with it once they have it).
They're FOR white people, at least nominally Christian, who agree with them. OTOH, they only appear to be for those people because there aren't enough millionaires and billionaires to win an election in any state in the union. So they have to hornswoggle lots of nervous white people of modest means into believing that it's all about owning the libs. Or whatever. Did I get that right?
You got that pretty much right! But not just about nervous white people owning the libs-- but also having their grievances against people of color, Jews, homosexuals and uppity women SEEM to be addressed.
Apart from the fact that I kinda respect and admire wolverines (in their native habitat, such as we've allowed them). They're cunning and ferocious and they occupy a niche. I think of TFG as more a rodent or scavenger or parasite than a capable predator.
The filibuster was created by mistake when the Senate, cleaning up its rule book in 1806, failed to include a provision to cut off debate. (A so-called cloture rule allowing two-thirds of senators to end a filibuster was adopted in 1917; the proportion was reduced to three-fifths in 1975.) The filibuster encouraged extremism, not comity: It was a favorite tool of pro-slavery senators before the Civil War and segregationists after it.
The discomfort was welling up yesterday over the partisanship of the Supreme Court. Now I am hanging onto a bucket hoping, wondering if this feeling will ever go away.
Might as well have the Trump Court show their colors before the next election. Then the women of America can respond, as well as men who aren't women haters.
I don’t think that will happen. It’s true that abortion is the quintessential feminist issue, but “most” women don’t get abortions and I doubt that the withdrawal of that right will change many votes.
I have never assumed that Manchin and Sinema were other than opportunists. Manchin isn't the brightest bulb in the chandelier as is obvious to almost everyone, but Sinema has held her cards so tightly, it is hard to know if she's wily or just wicked or both. But that said, BOTH of them have been in that Stinky Senate long enough to know the rules of the road and BOTH of them know Moscow Mitch for what he is. BOTH of them know that he uses the filibuster however he chooses - it can come or it can go as he sees fit. It's a gimmick. Like a toy rattle that the toddlers can shake in their little fists.
My bet is that BOTH of them have so much illicit and dark money (probably from Russia as well as Koch and others) that they don't dare buck the rest of the oligarchs on the other side of the aisle. As someone I held dear used to say, "They're afraid their gowns will fly up and we'll see what lies beneath." Ewww.
From the 1850's there's been a hard core states rights faction in America, sometimes with Democrats, other times with Republicans. Should Democrats keep the congress and win the presidency in 2024 the states rights faction will back up, quiet down and patiently wait. What choice do they have? The buffoonery in the Senate is not unnoticed. The Internet gives attention to all sides and most people being reasonable eventually figure out what is wrong. Rand Paul has no credibility and Mitch McConnell is universally seen as a hard core reactionary with an agenda written at the Federalist Society. The stench of corruption and ideology in the Senate will rise up and America will do something about it as they did in the 1890's. Do not underestimate the chance for serious reform of Senate rules.
Mitch McConnell remains popular with the only people who count: his loyal constituents who will continue to return him to office, because they LIKE what he's doing.
Wrong traitor; Hawley's insufferable in his own way, and those two can race Cruz and those genius Kennedy boys from Kansas and Louisiana to the bottom as the Senate continues to rot. Face it, these guys don't represent advanced civilizations in any case; I'm just surprised that they walk upright as much as they do.
My husband used to say that what we should do is eliminate the present Congress and do it a different way:
1. Make all terms (both House and Senate) 5 years, and no re-election. No chance of anyone staying in office more than 5 years. If you can't get your shit together by then, you were a lousy pick.
2. Make everyone eligible for being voted in. Your Mom's mailman, anyone without a criminal record who had never been in elective office before. Minimum age 18, maximum, 70.
3. Make the requirements a bit different: Nobody can have a net worth of over 1 million, and have no previous government experience.
4. Eliminate all lobbyists-ban them outright.
I think it would work but the multimillionaires who've been sitting in Congress for 30 years will have a shit fit and thus it wouldn't pass.
Too bad-it will rid us of the temper tantrum throwing crybabies who think it's all about them.
People who argue for term limits of any kind rarely reckon with how much power would likely wind up in the hands of staff, who aren't elected by or accountable to anyone. Unless the plan is to eliminate staff? In that case each newly elected official would have to start learning the ropes from scratch. That would be tough enough in my town of 3,500, never mind a congressional district of 700K or so or a state the size of, say, Illinois, New York, or Texas.
Both Manchin and Sinema may call themselves Democrats but look where the vast majority of their contributions come from. Corporate donors. They are reliable votes for these special interests ; as reliable as any Republican. But, think there is something else afoot here. It is the fact neither of these are the sharpest tacks in the box and seem susceptible to actually believing the trope that the Senate is the world's greatest deliberative body and that if they vote to suspend the filibuster rule they will, somehow , be committing a sin against the Constitution.
Both these Senators are punching way above their intellectual weight but in the end have surrendered to the oldest disease in the book; Believing your own publicity. Someone needs to bring them back to Earth and reality. Possible someone from the DNC who might inform them they will not be receiving any money for their upcoming runs to hold their seats. Losing them will not mean that much to the Ds as the more often than not cannot be depended upon.
Lucian...my assumption is that you used the ridiculous "greatest deliberative body in the world" facetiously. I was so disgusted by that body's hijinks last year that, assuming the only one who could have said such a thing had to be a senator, I checked the source. actually, there was no final determination, but most places said Daniel Webster, so uhhh....
"[McConnell] will.... go about the business of overturning every law passed by Democrats in the last 50 years beginning with Obamacare and going right through improvements in the areas of immigration, voting rights, campaign finance…anything with Democratic fingerprints on it...."
Will somebody PLEASE tell me something positive that the GOP is FOR?
All I see and hear is about destroying things. They want to: destroy abortion rights, destroy birth control, destroy sex education, destroy civil rights for minorities, destroy civil rights for homosexuals, destroy voting rights, destroy public education, destroy science, destroy the teaching of history, destroy unions, destroy environmental protections, destroy the IRS, destroy Medicaid, destroy Medicare, destroy Social Security, destroy gun control laws....have I left out anything else that the GOP wants to destroy? Assuming they were to succeed at all or most of these goals, what kind of a society to they envision? I would really like to know.
So well said. We are fighting the dark forces. The Jews must have felt the same way as the Nazi party gained power. Any good Republicans have been vanquished. afraid to speak out for fear of retribution.
Daughter of Holocaust victims here. Yes, they were terrified as I am now. The question is: What does TFG (the former guy) have on these Republicans? They are silent as lambs and that's what is worrying me.
Marlene Lerner Bigley, so sad for your family. What the Nazi's did to the Jews and those they considered enemies of the state is incomprehensible, even animals kill only for food for the most part, not out of hatred and envy. We think think no American government would ever ever do anything even close to that but I believe that if Trump ever got in power again he and his inner circle would be emboldened and who knows what they might do. We must pass that voting rights act. I don't think Manchin and Sinema and some others have a clue as to the danger we are in. They are in a world of the past, The radical faction of the GOP have taken over, they even praised the frenzied mob that attacked the Capitol as patriots. Trump was watching it all unfold with glee. I'm sure he would have continued to watch had they actually hanged him.
Thank you, Bob. Manchenema are both strange Democrats. I do, in fact, think that they absolutely do know what consequences we will be in for if the GOP is successful. It appears they are easily swayed by the almighty dollar. Sinema used to be a darling among progressives. Once she was in Congress, she has turned a blind eye to the ideals of the people she represents. Manchin is supposedly a “nice guy” but he is sorely out of touch with his constituents. He is, after all, an owner of a coal mine so he is a very wealthy white businessman whose workers are being killed by black lung disease. He and Sinema are simply jerks as they have repeatedly given us the middle finger.
He has votes he can threaten GOP with. Either supporting or diverting.
Imagine the books that will be written, cowards threatened by a coward!
Jabberwockey...BIGLY!
An Autocratic Fascist Theocracy
Yes-- an Autocratic Fascist FUNDAMENTALIST CHRISTIAN Theocracy
Gilead
Yup…the GOP wants to destroy those of us NOT in their political corner. I think this is where we bend over and kiss our arse goodbye!
money (yes, it amazes me as well that people can get so insanely destructive for just money, but maybe I don't understand because I've never had any) and "power" (inverted commas because, like many other people, I don't think they actually know what it is or what to do with it once they have it).
They're FOR white people, at least nominally Christian, who agree with them. OTOH, they only appear to be for those people because there aren't enough millionaires and billionaires to win an election in any state in the union. So they have to hornswoggle lots of nervous white people of modest means into believing that it's all about owning the libs. Or whatever. Did I get that right?
You got that pretty much right! But not just about nervous white people owning the libs-- but also having their grievances against people of color, Jews, homosexuals and uppity women SEEM to be addressed.
You got that right! They don't want to govern, they only want power and wealth for themselves.
When Trump embraced dictators you got your answer.
“as principled as a rabid wolverine” That’s a good one. Thank you, Lucian
Yes, I thought that was very descriptive of the triple-chined one!
Orange Foolius?
Apart from the fact that I kinda respect and admire wolverines (in their native habitat, such as we've allowed them). They're cunning and ferocious and they occupy a niche. I think of TFG as more a rodent or scavenger or parasite than a capable predator.
The filibuster was created by mistake when the Senate, cleaning up its rule book in 1806, failed to include a provision to cut off debate. (A so-called cloture rule allowing two-thirds of senators to end a filibuster was adopted in 1917; the proportion was reduced to three-fifths in 1975.) The filibuster encouraged extremism, not comity: It was a favorite tool of pro-slavery senators before the Civil War and segregationists after it.
Thank you for thinking about issues that make my head hurt. Nailed it, Lucian.
The discomfort was welling up yesterday over the partisanship of the Supreme Court. Now I am hanging onto a bucket hoping, wondering if this feeling will ever go away.
Might as well have the Trump Court show their colors before the next election. Then the women of America can respond, as well as men who aren't women haters.
I don’t think that will happen. It’s true that abortion is the quintessential feminist issue, but “most” women don’t get abortions and I doubt that the withdrawal of that right will change many votes.
You've had a string of home runs, Lucian. This is only the latest
And you still feel it's worth sticking around for the final act. Good on you Sir.
so tired of all this
America is a very depressing place these days….
I have never assumed that Manchin and Sinema were other than opportunists. Manchin isn't the brightest bulb in the chandelier as is obvious to almost everyone, but Sinema has held her cards so tightly, it is hard to know if she's wily or just wicked or both. But that said, BOTH of them have been in that Stinky Senate long enough to know the rules of the road and BOTH of them know Moscow Mitch for what he is. BOTH of them know that he uses the filibuster however he chooses - it can come or it can go as he sees fit. It's a gimmick. Like a toy rattle that the toddlers can shake in their little fists.
My bet is that BOTH of them have so much illicit and dark money (probably from Russia as well as Koch and others) that they don't dare buck the rest of the oligarchs on the other side of the aisle. As someone I held dear used to say, "They're afraid their gowns will fly up and we'll see what lies beneath." Ewww.
From the 1850's there's been a hard core states rights faction in America, sometimes with Democrats, other times with Republicans. Should Democrats keep the congress and win the presidency in 2024 the states rights faction will back up, quiet down and patiently wait. What choice do they have? The buffoonery in the Senate is not unnoticed. The Internet gives attention to all sides and most people being reasonable eventually figure out what is wrong. Rand Paul has no credibility and Mitch McConnell is universally seen as a hard core reactionary with an agenda written at the Federalist Society. The stench of corruption and ideology in the Senate will rise up and America will do something about it as they did in the 1890's. Do not underestimate the chance for serious reform of Senate rules.
Mitch McConnell remains popular with the only people who count: his loyal constituents who will continue to return him to office, because they LIKE what he's doing.
One correction, Lucian....Tom Cotton is not from Missouri.
Wrong traitor; Hawley's insufferable in his own way, and those two can race Cruz and those genius Kennedy boys from Kansas and Louisiana to the bottom as the Senate continues to rot. Face it, these guys don't represent advanced civilizations in any case; I'm just surprised that they walk upright as much as they do.
My husband used to say that what we should do is eliminate the present Congress and do it a different way:
1. Make all terms (both House and Senate) 5 years, and no re-election. No chance of anyone staying in office more than 5 years. If you can't get your shit together by then, you were a lousy pick.
2. Make everyone eligible for being voted in. Your Mom's mailman, anyone without a criminal record who had never been in elective office before. Minimum age 18, maximum, 70.
3. Make the requirements a bit different: Nobody can have a net worth of over 1 million, and have no previous government experience.
4. Eliminate all lobbyists-ban them outright.
I think it would work but the multimillionaires who've been sitting in Congress for 30 years will have a shit fit and thus it wouldn't pass.
Too bad-it will rid us of the temper tantrum throwing crybabies who think it's all about them.
People who argue for term limits of any kind rarely reckon with how much power would likely wind up in the hands of staff, who aren't elected by or accountable to anyone. Unless the plan is to eliminate staff? In that case each newly elected official would have to start learning the ropes from scratch. That would be tough enough in my town of 3,500, never mind a congressional district of 700K or so or a state the size of, say, Illinois, New York, or Texas.
Both Manchin and Sinema may call themselves Democrats but look where the vast majority of their contributions come from. Corporate donors. They are reliable votes for these special interests ; as reliable as any Republican. But, think there is something else afoot here. It is the fact neither of these are the sharpest tacks in the box and seem susceptible to actually believing the trope that the Senate is the world's greatest deliberative body and that if they vote to suspend the filibuster rule they will, somehow , be committing a sin against the Constitution.
Both these Senators are punching way above their intellectual weight but in the end have surrendered to the oldest disease in the book; Believing your own publicity. Someone needs to bring them back to Earth and reality. Possible someone from the DNC who might inform them they will not be receiving any money for their upcoming runs to hold their seats. Losing them will not mean that much to the Ds as the more often than not cannot be depended upon.
Lucian...my assumption is that you used the ridiculous "greatest deliberative body in the world" facetiously. I was so disgusted by that body's hijinks last year that, assuming the only one who could have said such a thing had to be a senator, I checked the source. actually, there was no final determination, but most places said Daniel Webster, so uhhh....
Biden says McConnell is a friend. That is a problem. Garland is week manchin corrupt and Sinima is just plain stupid.