Logistics is the reason Donald Trump will never, ever, even if he wins election and invokes the Alien and Sedition Act of 1798, be able to deport the 15 million, or 20 million, or 25 million – whatever the number he throws out seemingly according to his mood or state of mental deterioration.
Excellent as always. But you're trying to impose facts on the Trumptards. If they believed facts they wouldn't be supporting him. I could see him ordering illegal aliens loaded onto busses without anany regard to food, water or sanitation because he's a fucking fascist who doesn't care if they live or die. And Stephen Miller makes Trump look like a humanitarian by comparison.
It is foolish to think the orange traitor cares about rules or humanity where his deportation plan is concerned. First, it's not a plan, it's a threat. Second, he could care less if those people all died...it's no wonder the idiot's favorite president is Jackson, another heartless, callous man.
The only thing to do is elect Harris and a blue Congress and begin the demise of maga and the orange traitor. In my opinion, all those maga who want an authoritarian government are welcome to move to one, taking their disgusting leader and that nazi Miller with them. Maybe Russia? I'd suggest China or North Korea, but you know how much those people hate anyone who doesn't look just like them.
Not to speak of the fact that REAL patriots won't stand for it. They better factor in the casualties they'd take. Such an attempt at this foolishness would guarantee Civil War 2.0. Let's get this done on Nov. 5 so that doesn't happen. (I'm too old for this shit!)
Felonious Trump's idol, Adolph Hitler, managed to round up millions. I am sure using the Nazi template, Stephen Miller & Co. can get their shit together and round up an appreciable number of these migrants. However, the "now we got 'em, what do we do with 'em" question arises. Their countries of origin may not want them back or may not have the infrastructure to take them back. What then? I know! Gas chambers posing as showers. Then, of course, they are stuck with all those cadavers. What about large crematoria to get rid of them? There you have it. Problem resolved with a very familiar final solution.
Timothy Snyder has written extensively on what might happen in the rounding up and incarcerating of 20 million illegal immigrants. He reminds us that an error of 1% would amount to 200,000 people who did not even meet the basic standard of illegal. Many many legal citizens in the United States have Hispanic surnames. Not that I'm condoning Trump's plan to round up anybody. Just that the scale alone admits that it is a hideous and anti-human plan that we must stop. How do we stop it?
My state is 51 percent Hispanic. My state is Blue. Are we going to allow our neighbors, friends and family members to be rounded up and transported? I doubt it, although I have no doubt that the Nazis might try. There is no way in Hell to sort the native born from the immigrants. Everyone here is some shade of brown.
The horrifying truth is that many people saw their friends in Germany, Belgium, France, et al rounded up and transported---so in a sense they "allowed" it. History does not always provide comforting answers.....
Your comment had me chuckling out loud. Back before 2016 I was teaching as an adjunct biology professor and I told my neighbor I was going to have my DNA sequenced and show the data to my class to in part illustrate the point you just made. My neighbor warned me not to do it because "you never know what you might find out!" When I pointed out the common ancestry of all human beings he just looked looked grim and stopped talking. After 2016 I learned he was a trumpty and then I understood his "fear" much more clearly......
The DJ Trump does not know history. It is fed to him by Stephen Miller, the Jewish Nazi. I think Stephen reads excerpts of the book to DJ every night before tucking his Depends ass in bed.
Look, I know all about Nazism. My parents were victims of the Holocaust and my maternal grandparents were gassed in 1942. This would not have been accomplished without the complicity of the German people turning a blind eye. But as Lucian points out, rounding up that many immigrants (of which we all are) would be a Herculean task. Besides, we have technology that wasn’t invented in the 30’s & 40’s plus, we have enough of us aware folks who wouldn’t allow this to occur. More and more Republicans are voting for Kamala, not the other way around. Let’s go with that being our positive thought.
Another positive message is that when Democrats and their allies vote, Democrats win. When Democrats don't vote, as in 2016, Republicans win. Let's get out the vote!
People with Spanish surnames in this country and elsewhere have those names because they were colonized by Spain, which is a European country. Therefore your statement regarding "generations before Europeans arrived" is not possible.
I'll clarify. People lived in the American southwest for generations, if not centuries, before Europeans arrived. Many of those natives ended up with Spanish names, but they and their ancestors pre-date the Europeans, who were the immigrants and, ultimately, the colonizers.
Sorry friend, but that’s a very silly statement. I know many people forget this, but Spain, the empire that began chattel slavery in the Americas and began the genocide of the people living in the Americas , was actually a major European power. That’s where those surnames came from.
I forget in which state now (GA, AL, FL or NC?) there were instructions to purge from voter roles anyone with a Hispanic surname, no consideration that there are millions of Americans with Hispanic surnames who have lived in the U.S. for generations. Reminds me of the pope's reply, when asked how to distinguish between heretics and good Christians, to just kill them all, let god sort them out.
I know this is just based upon the movies I've seen, but Hitler crammed the Jews into railway cars that traveled a relatively short distance to concentration camps. Even with Miller that doesn't seem like a practicable solution for the vastly spread out United States.
Hitler never intended for them to live, either. Unless Trump has the same intentions for the undocumented people he “rounds up,” there’s no way to use a similar process here ..
I doubt Trump, Miller, Bannon and those other slimeballs care about logistics. The goal is to maintain power through fear. They don't care if employers lose millions of employees and other business owners. They don't care if the economy collapses because hospitals, farms, and other entities serving their communities lose millions of employees. They are willing to defy the Constitution, courts, and even, if need be, their legal team at SCOTUS. We've already seen they don't care if the people they want to deport sleep in the snow or starve or die.
The law and guardrails don't work unless a huge array of people, including law enforcement, legislators, and lawyers, enforce the law and maintain the guardrails. Sad to say, this country has an erratic record of actually enforcing the rule of law to guarantee the rights of unpopular people.
And how do we respond when Trump/Miller round up all the undocumented and documented immigrants only to farm them out, at a price paid directly to Trump, to farms, hotels, restaurants, food processors, and construction sites? We cannot ignore the probability that these nazis will follow the model of the German Nazis and use the slave labor to enrich the rich and powerful.
I don’t know if I agree with you entirely Peter, but I would love to have a detailed investigation of who built his wall and how that money moved around, don’t you know there’s some nefarious shit in that story. It’s right up his alley.
You ID many logistical considerations that presumably would give pause to rational thinkers. For ex., # of buses for transport, food for detainees, issuing orders. I don't think maga's henchmen, or base, will find themselves paused. The cruelty delivered, and on show, is their point.
I'll never say Trump, Miller, and the MAGA stormtroopers aren't serious, but no one wants this solution. Restricting immigration has support, actually sending millions out of the country not so much. No one would be left to cook our food, grow our food, build our houses, fix our cars, maintain our lawns, etc. etc. I'd like to see another story about all the undocumented immigrants employed by Trump in his country clubs. Not to mention all the close ties Trump, JD, Elon et.al. have to immigrants themselves. It's ridiculous. Again just raw hamburger for the poorly educated masses in MAGA.
Brilliant article this evening, Lucian, when I read how much money it's going to take to move that many Souls, I can't think of a single Congressmen who'd approve it or pass any legislation with regards to this nonsense. Thank You, for a good read this evening and will reStack ASAP 💯
I admire your optimism. I think Boebert, Gaetz, MT Green, and a number of others in Congress would love to vote for this, especially if they get time on air.
Written with a heavy 40s-movie German accent: you soft Americans and your "reality." Speaking of the '40s, and the all-too-obvious parallel, what's this about school busses? Aren't railroad cattle and freight cars more efficient? Isn't Stephen "concentration camp" Mueller, oops, Miller, looking through all those resumes and 2025 Project workers for the perfect replicant of Adolf Eichmann? However, if, as you posit, freight trains and busses aren't working, the models can be the "Bataan death march" of 1942, and the SS death marches of 1944-45, forcing emaciated concentration camp prisoners to shuffle to other camps as the Russian army approached. And thank you Lucian, for using the words "pipe" and "dream." Starting with T***p, these guys (and some gals) are smoking the opium of evil.
You’re using facts and logic to counter a concept of heinous proportions designed to tickle the reptilian brain-stem of T💩p’s cult followers and other low-IQ fellow citizens. The logistics are of no real concern. His handlers know this even if he can’t grasp the idea. He babbles about sharks and eating cats.
He is just the useful idiot of the moment, to be discarded when the Christian Dominionists take control.
As a veteran, I think I can speak for most of us: We sure as hell did not join the military to attack and shove around other Americans or foreigners in America! Trump, the f'n Vietnam War draft-dodger (thank you, Daddy!), doesn't have a clue as to why people sign up. It would never, ever occur to his distorted brain that he would join up to serve something other than himself.
I understand Truscott's point on the impossible logistics of mass deportation. But he doesn't factor in one thing: Trump's love of chaos. He could issue the orders, and just sit back wait for the system to buckle and collapse, and then rant about corrupt government, and generate even more chaos. That's his real goal. Trump doesn't care about problems and solutions, he wants to look like he's in charge, and generating as much drama as he can is part of his modus.
I suspect this is one of those things where he will issue an executive order and no one will actually do anything. His base will praise him as godlike, and meanwhile he will become so senile that he will forget why he did it and/or will just believe those who handle him when they tell him "its in the works, sir, your brilliant idea."
The oligarchs behind him certainly don't want the economy to crash--think of what will happen to construction of housing: construction is the largest employer of undocumented folks.
Wait, Lucian, you mean to tell us that Donald J. Trump hasn't thought this cruel, wildly ambitious scheme through? That it's all smoke and mirrors, a conjuring trick meant to hornswoggle the gullible cultists who still support him?
Sounds about right, thanks for burrowing down into the granular details and the hugely difficult problems with implementing it.
Are we not on the edge of an insane country, headed by a person (?) with no sense? How he persists and has followers takes some twisted thinking to get there. I don’t know, I don’t know! Does anyone?
If you go out into the fields and talk to the farmers, observe, you'll quiikely learn that most of the feild worker are immigrants. The pay is bad, and the work is backbreaking. Americans do not want to do that work.
Excellent as always. But you're trying to impose facts on the Trumptards. If they believed facts they wouldn't be supporting him. I could see him ordering illegal aliens loaded onto busses without anany regard to food, water or sanitation because he's a fucking fascist who doesn't care if they live or die. And Stephen Miller makes Trump look like a humanitarian by comparison.
Stephen Miller is a frightening human…freak show!
Trump wins, he is POTUS...scare anyone?
It is foolish to think the orange traitor cares about rules or humanity where his deportation plan is concerned. First, it's not a plan, it's a threat. Second, he could care less if those people all died...it's no wonder the idiot's favorite president is Jackson, another heartless, callous man.
The only thing to do is elect Harris and a blue Congress and begin the demise of maga and the orange traitor. In my opinion, all those maga who want an authoritarian government are welcome to move to one, taking their disgusting leader and that nazi Miller with them. Maybe Russia? I'd suggest China or North Korea, but you know how much those people hate anyone who doesn't look just like them.
True
Right!
Not to speak of the fact that REAL patriots won't stand for it. They better factor in the casualties they'd take. Such an attempt at this foolishness would guarantee Civil War 2.0. Let's get this done on Nov. 5 so that doesn't happen. (I'm too old for this shit!)
Me too!
Same here.
Felonious Trump's idol, Adolph Hitler, managed to round up millions. I am sure using the Nazi template, Stephen Miller & Co. can get their shit together and round up an appreciable number of these migrants. However, the "now we got 'em, what do we do with 'em" question arises. Their countries of origin may not want them back or may not have the infrastructure to take them back. What then? I know! Gas chambers posing as showers. Then, of course, they are stuck with all those cadavers. What about large crematoria to get rid of them? There you have it. Problem resolved with a very familiar final solution.
Timothy Snyder has written extensively on what might happen in the rounding up and incarcerating of 20 million illegal immigrants. He reminds us that an error of 1% would amount to 200,000 people who did not even meet the basic standard of illegal. Many many legal citizens in the United States have Hispanic surnames. Not that I'm condoning Trump's plan to round up anybody. Just that the scale alone admits that it is a hideous and anti-human plan that we must stop. How do we stop it?
They are not illegal. They are undocumented.
And they’re not aliens either!
Thank you.👍
Right 👍!
Sorry. The correct terms are so important. I DO mean undocumented. Thanks, Andrea.
And many people with Hispanic/Spanish surnames were here generations before European settlers arrived.
My state is 51 percent Hispanic. My state is Blue. Are we going to allow our neighbors, friends and family members to be rounded up and transported? I doubt it, although I have no doubt that the Nazis might try. There is no way in Hell to sort the native born from the immigrants. Everyone here is some shade of brown.
The horrifying truth is that many people saw their friends in Germany, Belgium, France, et al rounded up and transported---so in a sense they "allowed" it. History does not always provide comforting answers.....
And dare we remind everyone that we're all descendants of the first original homo sapiens who emerged in Africa and then migrated around the world.
Your comment had me chuckling out loud. Back before 2016 I was teaching as an adjunct biology professor and I told my neighbor I was going to have my DNA sequenced and show the data to my class to in part illustrate the point you just made. My neighbor warned me not to do it because "you never know what you might find out!" When I pointed out the common ancestry of all human beings he just looked looked grim and stopped talking. After 2016 I learned he was a trumpty and then I understood his "fear" much more clearly......
they just found another new hominid species in South Africa, dated 300,000 years old!....
The DJ Trump does not know history. It is fed to him by Stephen Miller, the Jewish Nazi. I think Stephen reads excerpts of the book to DJ every night before tucking his Depends ass in bed.
Look, I know all about Nazism. My parents were victims of the Holocaust and my maternal grandparents were gassed in 1942. This would not have been accomplished without the complicity of the German people turning a blind eye. But as Lucian points out, rounding up that many immigrants (of which we all are) would be a Herculean task. Besides, we have technology that wasn’t invented in the 30’s & 40’s plus, we have enough of us aware folks who wouldn’t allow this to occur. More and more Republicans are voting for Kamala, not the other way around. Let’s go with that being our positive thought.
Another positive message is that when Democrats and their allies vote, Democrats win. When Democrats don't vote, as in 2016, Republicans win. Let's get out the vote!
People with Spanish surnames in this country and elsewhere have those names because they were colonized by Spain, which is a European country. Therefore your statement regarding "generations before Europeans arrived" is not possible.
I'll clarify. People lived in the American southwest for generations, if not centuries, before Europeans arrived. Many of those natives ended up with Spanish names, but they and their ancestors pre-date the Europeans, who were the immigrants and, ultimately, the colonizers.
Sorry friend, but that’s a very silly statement. I know many people forget this, but Spain, the empire that began chattel slavery in the Americas and began the genocide of the people living in the Americas , was actually a major European power. That’s where those surnames came from.
VOTE 🙏
I forget in which state now (GA, AL, FL or NC?) there were instructions to purge from voter roles anyone with a Hispanic surname, no consideration that there are millions of Americans with Hispanic surnames who have lived in the U.S. for generations. Reminds me of the pope's reply, when asked how to distinguish between heretics and good Christians, to just kill them all, let god sort them out.
Whew.
I know this is just based upon the movies I've seen, but Hitler crammed the Jews into railway cars that traveled a relatively short distance to concentration camps. Even with Miller that doesn't seem like a practicable solution for the vastly spread out United States.
Hitler never intended for them to live, either. Unless Trump has the same intentions for the undocumented people he “rounds up,” there’s no way to use a similar process here ..
Trump gets a chubby just thinking about hurting people or watching them be hurt. It's all he talks about. I wish G*D would smite him.
We have to smite his trajectory and vote him down
Actually they didn’t travel relatively short distances…many traveled goodly distances to death camps…
Yes, many were sent to concentration camps from France and Italy to Germany, Czechoslovakia and Poland.
Exactly what I was thinking. Don’t worry about food or water or shelter just follow the Nazi handbook.
I doubt Trump, Miller, Bannon and those other slimeballs care about logistics. The goal is to maintain power through fear. They don't care if employers lose millions of employees and other business owners. They don't care if the economy collapses because hospitals, farms, and other entities serving their communities lose millions of employees. They are willing to defy the Constitution, courts, and even, if need be, their legal team at SCOTUS. We've already seen they don't care if the people they want to deport sleep in the snow or starve or die.
The law and guardrails don't work unless a huge array of people, including law enforcement, legislators, and lawyers, enforce the law and maintain the guardrails. Sad to say, this country has an erratic record of actually enforcing the rule of law to guarantee the rights of unpopular people.
And how do we respond when Trump/Miller round up all the undocumented and documented immigrants only to farm them out, at a price paid directly to Trump, to farms, hotels, restaurants, food processors, and construction sites? We cannot ignore the probability that these nazis will follow the model of the German Nazis and use the slave labor to enrich the rich and powerful.
I don’t know if I agree with you entirely Peter, but I would love to have a detailed investigation of who built his wall and how that money moved around, don’t you know there’s some nefarious shit in that story. It’s right up his alley.
Whatever it takes!
You ID many logistical considerations that presumably would give pause to rational thinkers. For ex., # of buses for transport, food for detainees, issuing orders. I don't think maga's henchmen, or base, will find themselves paused. The cruelty delivered, and on show, is their point.
I'll never say Trump, Miller, and the MAGA stormtroopers aren't serious, but no one wants this solution. Restricting immigration has support, actually sending millions out of the country not so much. No one would be left to cook our food, grow our food, build our houses, fix our cars, maintain our lawns, etc. etc. I'd like to see another story about all the undocumented immigrants employed by Trump in his country clubs. Not to mention all the close ties Trump, JD, Elon et.al. have to immigrants themselves. It's ridiculous. Again just raw hamburger for the poorly educated masses in MAGA.
Brilliant article this evening, Lucian, when I read how much money it's going to take to move that many Souls, I can't think of a single Congressmen who'd approve it or pass any legislation with regards to this nonsense. Thank You, for a good read this evening and will reStack ASAP 💯
I admire your optimism. I think Boebert, Gaetz, MT Green, and a number of others in Congress would love to vote for this, especially if they get time on air.
Written with a heavy 40s-movie German accent: you soft Americans and your "reality." Speaking of the '40s, and the all-too-obvious parallel, what's this about school busses? Aren't railroad cattle and freight cars more efficient? Isn't Stephen "concentration camp" Mueller, oops, Miller, looking through all those resumes and 2025 Project workers for the perfect replicant of Adolf Eichmann? However, if, as you posit, freight trains and busses aren't working, the models can be the "Bataan death march" of 1942, and the SS death marches of 1944-45, forcing emaciated concentration camp prisoners to shuffle to other camps as the Russian army approached. And thank you Lucian, for using the words "pipe" and "dream." Starting with T***p, these guys (and some gals) are smoking the opium of evil.
You’re using facts and logic to counter a concept of heinous proportions designed to tickle the reptilian brain-stem of T💩p’s cult followers and other low-IQ fellow citizens. The logistics are of no real concern. His handlers know this even if he can’t grasp the idea. He babbles about sharks and eating cats.
He is just the useful idiot of the moment, to be discarded when the Christian Dominionists take control.
As a veteran, I think I can speak for most of us: We sure as hell did not join the military to attack and shove around other Americans or foreigners in America! Trump, the f'n Vietnam War draft-dodger (thank you, Daddy!), doesn't have a clue as to why people sign up. It would never, ever occur to his distorted brain that he would join up to serve something other than himself.
How can any military person vote for Trump the draft dodger?. The guy who thinks the people who server are all losers? How can they?
Very good question Arne, I’m a vet and can’t fathom it either.
I understand Truscott's point on the impossible logistics of mass deportation. But he doesn't factor in one thing: Trump's love of chaos. He could issue the orders, and just sit back wait for the system to buckle and collapse, and then rant about corrupt government, and generate even more chaos. That's his real goal. Trump doesn't care about problems and solutions, he wants to look like he's in charge, and generating as much drama as he can is part of his modus.
I suspect this is one of those things where he will issue an executive order and no one will actually do anything. His base will praise him as godlike, and meanwhile he will become so senile that he will forget why he did it and/or will just believe those who handle him when they tell him "its in the works, sir, your brilliant idea."
The oligarchs behind him certainly don't want the economy to crash--think of what will happen to construction of housing: construction is the largest employer of undocumented folks.
Wait, Lucian, you mean to tell us that Donald J. Trump hasn't thought this cruel, wildly ambitious scheme through? That it's all smoke and mirrors, a conjuring trick meant to hornswoggle the gullible cultists who still support him?
Sounds about right, thanks for burrowing down into the granular details and the hugely difficult problems with implementing it.
Are we not on the edge of an insane country, headed by a person (?) with no sense? How he persists and has followers takes some twisted thinking to get there. I don’t know, I don’t know! Does anyone?
If you go out into the fields and talk to the farmers, observe, you'll quiikely learn that most of the feild worker are immigrants. The pay is bad, and the work is backbreaking. Americans do not want to do that work.