I just watched a full hour of some very, very smart legal eagles analyzing what it means that the Supreme Court decided today to hear Donald Trump’s immunity appeal.
If SCOTUS decides there is presidential immunity, Joe Biden should pick up the phone and turn Seal Team Six loose on P1135809. Yes, it's a criminal act. But he can't be prosecuted for it, can he? Or does immunity only apply to Republican presidents?
Good point, George. Theoretically if they did rule that a sitting president had absolute immunity from prosecution, Biden could have all the SC justices mentioned executed by a firing squad.
All theoretical of course - completely ridiculous, but points out the absurdity of the whole thing. Why would a so-called distinguished body even hold a hearing involving immunity of anyone let alone the president. We would become another Russia overnight that would have an untouchable dictator. just like Putin if Trump got elected. Plus he'd never leave office, since deciding to stay would be an official act.
Why would a so-called distinguished body even hold a hearing involving immunity of anyone let alone the president? Obviously, to prevent the monster toddler from being convicted before November.
But he faces three other criminal trials. Aileen Cannon will not let him be tried before November for stealing classified documents. Fani Willis's sex life, which has nothing to do with the trial, may nevertheless delay the trial. But Alvin Bragg's New York prosecution is scheduled to begin on March 25, and, absent unforeseen events, should finish in plenty of time. Let's just hope that the monster toddler is convicted and sentenced to prison. Some say that he won't get prison time merely for paying hush money, but his crime was serious. I've read that he might not have won in 2016 if his relationship with Stormy Daniels had been publicized.
I hadn't thought about the last part; obviously that was why he paid her off, because of the adverse effects that would have had on the electorate: Now the MAGA crowd don't care what he did. .
When SCOTUS rules, Joe Biden will still be the president. He should act immediately if they decide presidents have immunity. I'm thinking something medieval for P1135809 and the SCOTUS majority: drawing, quartering and racking come to mind.
Haha, but upon reflection I was thinking along the lines of less severe but longer lasting humiliation such as bringing back the public stocks where people could throw rotten fruit etc., at them :) . . ." In medieval times, stocks served a dual purpose as both a form of punishment and a means of public humiliation. These medieval punishment devices were designed to restrain and expose offenders, ensuring that their transgressions were publicly known and serving as a deterrent for others.
The stocks were a wooden framework with holes cut out for the offender’s legs and sometimes hands, depending on the severity of the crime. Offenders would be placed in the stocks in a public square or marketplace, where they would be subjected to the scrutiny and derision of the community.
The primary function of stocks was to physically restrain the offender, limiting their mobility and making them vulnerable to verbal and physical abuse from onlookers. By immobilizing the legs or hands, stocks prevented the offender from escaping or defending themselves, intensifying their sense of humiliation.
The Purpose of Public Punishment and Humiliation
Public punishment served as a visible reminder of the consequences of breaking societal norms and laws.
Humiliation aimed to shame the offender and reinforce social order.
It acted as a form of entertainment, drawing crowds who would jeer, mock, and sometimes throw objects at the offender.
Through the use of stocks, the punishment was not only physically restraining but also psychologically damaging. The public nature of the punishment intensified the shame and humiliation experienced by the offender, as they were exposed to the judgment of their peers.
The practice of using stocks in medieval times reflects the harshness of the justice system and the role of public humiliation as a means of social control. It highlights the power dynamics and the severity of punishments imposed during that era.
Medieval Punishment and Torture: A Brutal Era
During the Middle Ages, punishment and torture were widely utilized to maintain social order and deter criminal behavior.
The penalties imposed during this era were notorious for their brutality and the extreme suffering they inflicted upon offenders.
Various forms of punishment were employed, ranging from public floggings and mutilations to more severe practices such as branding and execution.
One particularly harrowing aspect of medieval punishment was the utilization of torture as a means of extracting confessions and punishing alleged wrongdoers.
These punishments aimed not only to physically harm the individual but also to instill fear and reinforce the authority of the ruling powers....."
I agree that the orange traitor must go before a real court to be tried for treason. The SCJ who accept money and favors from wealthy business owners must be barred from practicing law, and anyone who is accused of sexual assault, or believes this country should be ruled according to a religion, should be removed from the court. (they should not have been appointed to begin with.)
President Biden must be determined to save our democracy and declare martial law if need be. When the election is over and he wins (assuming he wins-if he keeps catering to the authoritarian netanyahu, he may lose crucial votes), the right wing maniacs are going to try to overthrow it again, this time with more force. This time, the DOJ must act immediately and prosecute the offenders, holding them in prison until their trials. (Pres. Biden needs to appoint a new attorney general who will take off the gloves.) This is my view on the whole mess this morning after waking up to the wrong decision the SC has made.
I will also add that anyone in either house of Congress who supported the 1/6 travesty should be removed from office.
Joe seems to be doing everything in his power to LOSE this election, and this week has been shameful. The optics of eating an ice cream cone while commenting on atrocities in Gaza, and today saying a massacre by IDF soldiers on civilians was "complicating" ceasefire talks -- well those are simply beyond awful.
Oh, I'm convinced Trump will NEVER leave office again if he gets back in. Why risk being taken to court again? He's not going anywhere and he'll suspend elections, declare martial law, grant himself "emergency" powers, or have the Constitution changed, whatever he feels like doing, and the Supine GOP will eagerly go along to share in the crumbs of the spoils.
Yes, Kozmo, no question about it. The big question is will the army step in to stop him? Their oath is to the costitution. The question is how many top brass are Trump supporters.
As they say across the pond. BRILLIANT OLD CHUM, BRILLIANT. I would suggest Joe go a bit further. Send in the 101 to arrest all sitting GOP members of the House and send them to a camp where they can be "reeducated" to the real meaning of the Constitution. Put Republican Senators under house arrest and declare them personna non grata. Immediately introduce legislation in both Houses to make abortion and gay marriage legal. Pass a bill restoring the progressive incomd tax and raise the tax on capital gains to 50%. All "official acts." OH, and that Supreme Court? Immediately to be expanded to include another seven justices. Not one of which will be endorsed by the Fedralist Society.
It’s fucking terrifying and the fact that Roberts did not order Thomas to recuse himself is maddening! I only trust the three women who sit on the bench: one Black, one Hispanic, and one Jewish. I listened to Nicolle’s show and you’re so right about her being good. When you have Judge Luttig on and his reaction was one of being flabbergasted, you know that the 6 justices are corrupt. It’s past time for We, The People, to demand Thomas to be removed and impeached!
I don't know whether Roberts could force Thomas to recuse himself. What he could do, however, is tell Thomas that, if he doesn't recuse himself, he, Roberts, will publicly criticize him for violating judicial ethics. Other justices could join Roberts in that. Sorry, my fantasies sometimes get away from me.
We inundate our reps and senators relentlessly with our anger. We write to MSM, relentlessly too. We write to the local newspapers that we are angry that the justices do not consider the people who inhabit this nation as being denied justice. I marched in protests in the Vietnam War which helped to bring our soldiers, doctors, and nurses home. I burned my bra so that women could have abortions and be offered birth control. I educated myself about Affirmative Action and voted for it. I was there when VRA was passed. I want all if that to return but if we have a fight on our hands, fight we must!
Thank you! I am formerly from NC and left after high school to go to DC. Best experience of my life. Took my daughters in 2019 back there for the Women’s March. They appreciated the area so much. Even went to Congress for a day. All of the R’s looked like “white cotton-heads”, according to my kids. 😃
Terrifying is the word for today. Between Little Mike Johnson and the Supreme Court decision to hear Trump's immunity claim, I feel totally disheartened. It's almost impossible to maintain faith in our rule of law.
I disagree. The fix is clearly in at the most corrupt Court in our history. This Court is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the Republican Party and the Federalist Society and they no longer care who knows it. We can thank Garland for dragging his feet on prosecuting Trump, but of course Garland is Federalist Society and is a plant who snookered Biden into appointing him. Biden should fire Garland today and give us an AG with a commitment to the rule of law - not that the rule of law is going to matter after the Extremes get done with it. I also note the fact that the DC Circuit Court ruling that the Extremes just pissed on was the product of three female judges, and we know how the fascists on this court feel about uppity women.
I am terrified, in despair and very close to being utterly defeated, and I'm too old and too poor to get out of this horrible country. All we can do is try to fight back, because I'm damned if I'm going to allow myself to be put in a concentration camp.
I'm not so sure either. I'm 74, and after surviving Nixon and Bush I did not expect to spend my last years in a fascist hellhole. Too old now to hide out in the mountains like members of the French Resistance.
Wait, you live somewhere so awful, in the United States, that one crackpot decision from the SCOTUS - even if Trump gets shellacked in the election, or to make it easier to make your case, if he wins - is therefore a "fascist hellhole," where no one will organize to fight back, really?
I admit I live in a city that made headlines for months fighting back in 2020, but I can't believe this place is THAT singular!
I appreciate your point of view Mr. Trumbull but please explain how people can “organize to fight back”. As an anti Vietnam war activist I tried that in 1968 and when I got a draft notice at 24 years of age I went to Canada. I ultimately succumbed to legal and family pressure and reported for induction. There was no way out for me.
Yes, these are the sad facts that come out when disgruntled Americans really check into "moving to Canada."
Canada will have to build a wall. Millions of us will want OUT and they're not prepared to accept us, any more than we accept all the Latin Americans we helped impoverish.
Lucian, I just wrote this letter to an old college friend which I think applies to what you wrote and then some...
______ I do not gainsay what you have written to me. Biden is not as sharp as he once was, like all old men over eighty, he has lost some but still functions quite well. I am aware of those you discussed former staffers for Obama. None of them, none said he was no longer capable of governing. And NONE of them are working in the White House at present. They are outsiders giving their views.
I wish Biden had done as he said he would, be a one term president. But he has not and is running against Trump.
What I think you do not understand nor does your wonderful, lovely wife is why I am so adamant, so horrified about this election and why I write to you! Please read the following and I hope you will then understand:
I studied extensively Germany in the 1930s and wrote on the translated diaries, newspapers in a long paper. Sadly and frighteningly, what happened there is exactly what is happening in America. The educated, the "decent" common German, the professionals, looked the other way as dear leader took over the media, the courts, the educational system, and the military. They looked the other way as the scapegoats were blamed and then eliminated. The gypsies, the Jews, the mentally deficient, the communists, all those who disagreed with Der Fuhrer. In other words, to get those things they wanted, to "make Germany great again," it no longer mattered that their leader was a pathological liar, was a criminal, was an insurrectionist, actually said the ugly things he was going to do. And as Krystal Nacht and one horror after another happened, they looked the other way.
It was more important that they got the "things" they wanted.
In 1929 most people thought Hitler was a clown, a joke, but they were sure he could be controlled. And in Germany those were professionals like the judges, the engineers, accountants, professors, biologists, scientists as well as "the common" German. Yep, they got what they wanted as they looked the other way. And how did that work out for them in the end?
I decided that unlike those Germans who looked the other way, in the US as MAGA takes over, I had to stand up. And yes, I hope the intelligent Americans will see this evil. I might fail but I will be damned if I "look the other way" just to get some "things" I want. And when Trump tells us he is immune from all our laws, can do anything he wants as president, if that does not scare you, I do not then understand you. Since I am a Christian, I know Trump stands for everything Jesus told us not to do. Love was the center for Christ. Can any Christian look at Trump and say, "he is one of us?!?!?" When Trump was asked what acts of his life he had asked forgiveness of God, he answered, "I have never done anything wrong, why would I have to ask for forgiveness?"
This is a human who has cheated on all of his three wives, was caught on tape bragging about grabbing women by the pussy cause they let you when you are a star. This is a "business man" who has destroyed the little guy in business throughout his life. I sent you the true story of one person I know through ....... who Trump destroyed. He did that to literally hundreds!! This is a criminal who even gathered the mob, incited them, sent them to the Capital to stop the legal voting, they invaded, he did nothing for hours, then when he saw his insurrection failed, he told them to go home, told them he was proud of them, he loved them. OMG.
This is a man who denigrates our veterans, mocks them, mocked John McCain and his bravery.
Yes, , I hope and pray that the intelligent voter will not "look the other way." That might be a forlorn hope and a wasted prayer on you and those professional people you know who "look the other way" but I fervently feel we must stand up in the face of this evil.
Just moments ago SCOTUS, now in control of MAGA, will now decide if a president is immune from the law. They will hear the case on April 22rd. That pretty much insures there will be no trial before the election in November. Just like Hitler did with the courts in Germany, moved all decisions until he controlled Germany. Then all cases were dismissed. Fact.
I also watched Nicole Wallace today, and came away very discouraged. I do feel like the far right justices know they can’t grant absolute immunity, but the next best thing is to run the clock and delay any chance of prosecution until after the election. You know . . . . the election the maga says they will not allow a Democrat to win no matter what. This makes me sick to my stomach, and beyond angry.
Terrifying indeed, Lucian. I’m a bit stunned actually. Given the thoroughness of the DC Appeals Court’s brief, it seemed likely that SCOTUS would uphold it. I should have known better. As you say, the fix isn’t in yet for sure, but increasingly it’s looking likely. If that’s the case SCOTUS is corrupted and our democracy is on the verge of ending.
Yet again, we the people must save ourselves by voting against Trump returning to the White House. There looks to be no other way to stop a second Trump term at this point.
I have been warning about the Christian Dominionists for decades-- mostly to deaf ears-- liberal friends who thought I was over-reacting to a ridiculous degree, while others said I was an anti-religious bigot.
In the middle 80's I had a friend who had me over to her house one evening. She had the "left behind" series of books on her coffee table. She kept insisting to me that they were all true. I left and never went back.
I am bigoted against parasitic offshoots of traditional religion but am somewhat religious myself. As long as there is a firm separation between church and state, and nobody is hurting anyone else, religion can be a gel that holds a society together and buttresses humanistic values. But I so get your sentiment, because, yep, it sure seems like a net negative right now!
And the Catholic Fundies are right there in cahoots!! Do you see the 'sacred heart of jesus' behind Bannon's head??? Include Alito, Coney Barrett, Flynn, Barr, & Kavanaugh and many others.
American Liberals think (or used to think) in terms of open democratic systems. Problems that arose or might arise were thought to be amenable to correction, along those lines.
They dismissed the idea that outside groups or individuals feeding on and undermining those systems could gain control.
Canadians, in general, have a very dim view of the American political system. That might give us an edge on seeing events unfolding in the US in a slightly different way.
We're less inclined to throw up our hands and say, "Oh that could never happen in the US" Most of us think anything is possible, politically, in the US.
I am really shocked that they agreed to hear this ludicrous appeal. If immunity is conferred to Trump in this case, they really will have overturned 248 years of resistance to monarchy. It will be game over.
The only remedy would be this: Trump soundly and solidly defeated at the ballot box. And then, President Biden and the Congress expand the Court and (if Trump is successful in arguing for immunity) hand down a decision soundly rejecting presidential immunity.
If that doesn't happen, we have lost everything people have fought and died for since 1776.
“When it is laid down as a maxim that a King can do no wrong, it places him in a state of similar security with that of idiots and persons insane, and responsibility is out of the question with respect to himself.”
– Thomas Paine, The Rights of Man, Conclusion (1791-2)
The American Revolution turns out to be a sham and a waste of time. I'd rather we stuck with King George III than wind up in a Trump dynasty despotism.
This is devastating, but didn’t surprise me. When SCOTUS refused to hear the immunity case when Jack Smith asked to bypass the Appeals court it wreaked of delay. It’s obvious there are six members of SCOTUS that are working for Leonard Leo, Harlan Crowe, Federalist Society, Heritage Foundation, etc, etc etc, and not we the people. The fascist oligarchs are getting closer to complete rule. Our democracy is not lost yet if we work to get the information out and enough people vote blue like our life depends on it. Because it does.
We can vote blue until we are blue in the face, but people, trump will TAKE THE WIN! And all we can do is sit and cry!! Because this game is being played over our little bitty heads and we cant do anything to stop it. ITS SO HORRIBLE.
I’d wait until the day after the decision. Could cancel the election at the same time and formally disband the Republican Party. Confiscate the assets of everyone in the Federalist Society. Arrest and deport to Russia every elected Republican official. All legal, amirite?
There won't be a decision though. They'll just run out the clock. If they didn't and actually had the balls to decide the prez was immune, Biden might actual use the decision and they won't risk that.
The election will be the decision. If Trump wins, game over. If Biden wins, then what?
Reading SCOTUS referred to as "a gaggle of stary-eyed authoritarian moonies to the highest court in the land" made my day.
As to the case, itself, by me it's a toss-up. The fixed judges might vote to support Trump (and still be outnumbered) or ... knowing the heat is on, do the right thing to try to right their crooked ship to some degree.
Reading through all these “it's over, America is done” comments is almost as depressing as the moonies agreeing to hear the case. So thanks for your small note of optimism!
Seems likely to me that taking the case is a fig leaf for their “fucking Federalist Society” overlords. They know they can't grant immunity without literally blowing up the entire republic, so they're offering a delay as a dodge.
As far as I know bribery is still illegal. DOJ could prosecute both Thomas and Alito as bribees and Crow or whomever else is guilty as the bribers. But it won’t because DOJ is in on it.
If SCOTUS decides there is presidential immunity, Joe Biden should pick up the phone and turn Seal Team Six loose on P1135809. Yes, it's a criminal act. But he can't be prosecuted for it, can he? Or does immunity only apply to Republican presidents?
Good point, George. Theoretically if they did rule that a sitting president had absolute immunity from prosecution, Biden could have all the SC justices mentioned executed by a firing squad.
All theoretical of course - completely ridiculous, but points out the absurdity of the whole thing. Why would a so-called distinguished body even hold a hearing involving immunity of anyone let alone the president. We would become another Russia overnight that would have an untouchable dictator. just like Putin if Trump got elected. Plus he'd never leave office, since deciding to stay would be an official act.
Why would a so-called distinguished body even hold a hearing involving immunity of anyone let alone the president? Obviously, to prevent the monster toddler from being convicted before November.
But he faces three other criminal trials. Aileen Cannon will not let him be tried before November for stealing classified documents. Fani Willis's sex life, which has nothing to do with the trial, may nevertheless delay the trial. But Alvin Bragg's New York prosecution is scheduled to begin on March 25, and, absent unforeseen events, should finish in plenty of time. Let's just hope that the monster toddler is convicted and sentenced to prison. Some say that he won't get prison time merely for paying hush money, but his crime was serious. I've read that he might not have won in 2016 if his relationship with Stormy Daniels had been publicized.
For sure, Henry, good points
I hadn't thought about the last part; obviously that was why he paid her off, because of the adverse effects that would have had on the electorate: Now the MAGA crowd don't care what he did. .
That is the part that makes it election interference. The FELONY.
Here's hoping that finally, the orange traitor will actually be held accountable and convicted for what he clearly did.
When SCOTUS rules, Joe Biden will still be the president. He should act immediately if they decide presidents have immunity. I'm thinking something medieval for P1135809 and the SCOTUS majority: drawing, quartering and racking come to mind.
That would be appropriate for the century the kristo-fascists want to take us to.
Haha, but upon reflection I was thinking along the lines of less severe but longer lasting humiliation such as bringing back the public stocks where people could throw rotten fruit etc., at them :) . . ." In medieval times, stocks served a dual purpose as both a form of punishment and a means of public humiliation. These medieval punishment devices were designed to restrain and expose offenders, ensuring that their transgressions were publicly known and serving as a deterrent for others.
The stocks were a wooden framework with holes cut out for the offender’s legs and sometimes hands, depending on the severity of the crime. Offenders would be placed in the stocks in a public square or marketplace, where they would be subjected to the scrutiny and derision of the community.
The primary function of stocks was to physically restrain the offender, limiting their mobility and making them vulnerable to verbal and physical abuse from onlookers. By immobilizing the legs or hands, stocks prevented the offender from escaping or defending themselves, intensifying their sense of humiliation.
The Purpose of Public Punishment and Humiliation
Public punishment served as a visible reminder of the consequences of breaking societal norms and laws.
Humiliation aimed to shame the offender and reinforce social order.
It acted as a form of entertainment, drawing crowds who would jeer, mock, and sometimes throw objects at the offender.
Through the use of stocks, the punishment was not only physically restraining but also psychologically damaging. The public nature of the punishment intensified the shame and humiliation experienced by the offender, as they were exposed to the judgment of their peers.
The practice of using stocks in medieval times reflects the harshness of the justice system and the role of public humiliation as a means of social control. It highlights the power dynamics and the severity of punishments imposed during that era.
Medieval Punishment and Torture: A Brutal Era
During the Middle Ages, punishment and torture were widely utilized to maintain social order and deter criminal behavior.
The penalties imposed during this era were notorious for their brutality and the extreme suffering they inflicted upon offenders.
Various forms of punishment were employed, ranging from public floggings and mutilations to more severe practices such as branding and execution.
One particularly harrowing aspect of medieval punishment was the utilization of torture as a means of extracting confessions and punishing alleged wrongdoers.
These punishments aimed not only to physically harm the individual but also to instill fear and reinforce the authority of the ruling powers....."
https://knightstemplar.co/medieval-stocks-torture-a-harrowing-history/#google_vignette
I would get in line to hurl things!
:) :) Haha Rotten tomatoes or fish heads?
Road apples
Both, I guess.
You could charge people a dollar to throw things and pay off the national debt in a day.
I agree that the orange traitor must go before a real court to be tried for treason. The SCJ who accept money and favors from wealthy business owners must be barred from practicing law, and anyone who is accused of sexual assault, or believes this country should be ruled according to a religion, should be removed from the court. (they should not have been appointed to begin with.)
President Biden must be determined to save our democracy and declare martial law if need be. When the election is over and he wins (assuming he wins-if he keeps catering to the authoritarian netanyahu, he may lose crucial votes), the right wing maniacs are going to try to overthrow it again, this time with more force. This time, the DOJ must act immediately and prosecute the offenders, holding them in prison until their trials. (Pres. Biden needs to appoint a new attorney general who will take off the gloves.) This is my view on the whole mess this morning after waking up to the wrong decision the SC has made.
I will also add that anyone in either house of Congress who supported the 1/6 travesty should be removed from office.
Joe seems to be doing everything in his power to LOSE this election, and this week has been shameful. The optics of eating an ice cream cone while commenting on atrocities in Gaza, and today saying a massacre by IDF soldiers on civilians was "complicating" ceasefire talks -- well those are simply beyond awful.
I wonder what his advisors are telling him.
Oh, I'm convinced Trump will NEVER leave office again if he gets back in. Why risk being taken to court again? He's not going anywhere and he'll suspend elections, declare martial law, grant himself "emergency" powers, or have the Constitution changed, whatever he feels like doing, and the Supine GOP will eagerly go along to share in the crumbs of the spoils.
Bye-Bye Melanoma!
Yes, Kozmo, no question about it. The big question is will the army step in to stop him? Their oath is to the costitution. The question is how many top brass are Trump supporters.
As they say across the pond. BRILLIANT OLD CHUM, BRILLIANT. I would suggest Joe go a bit further. Send in the 101 to arrest all sitting GOP members of the House and send them to a camp where they can be "reeducated" to the real meaning of the Constitution. Put Republican Senators under house arrest and declare them personna non grata. Immediately introduce legislation in both Houses to make abortion and gay marriage legal. Pass a bill restoring the progressive incomd tax and raise the tax on capital gains to 50%. All "official acts." OH, and that Supreme Court? Immediately to be expanded to include another seven justices. Not one of which will be endorsed by the Fedralist Society.
Such a delicious fantasy.
Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander
It seems to me the GOP is pushing this prez immunity idea with the assumption that there will never again be a Dem president.
Ya think?
Oh yes. Biden should send Drumpf to Gitmo and then have him Putinized. Why not? It's him or himself.
Biden should lock up a bunch of those "Justices" too, while he's at it, and banish Loose Cannon to a desert island.
It’s fucking terrifying and the fact that Roberts did not order Thomas to recuse himself is maddening! I only trust the three women who sit on the bench: one Black, one Hispanic, and one Jewish. I listened to Nicolle’s show and you’re so right about her being good. When you have Judge Luttig on and his reaction was one of being flabbergasted, you know that the 6 justices are corrupt. It’s past time for We, The People, to demand Thomas to be removed and impeached!
I don't know whether Roberts could force Thomas to recuse himself. What he could do, however, is tell Thomas that, if he doesn't recuse himself, he, Roberts, will publicly criticize him for violating judicial ethics. Other justices could join Roberts in that. Sorry, my fantasies sometimes get away from me.
I want whatever you're smoking.
Long Live Luttig
How do you suggest that "we the people" do that?
We inundate our reps and senators relentlessly with our anger. We write to MSM, relentlessly too. We write to the local newspapers that we are angry that the justices do not consider the people who inhabit this nation as being denied justice. I marched in protests in the Vietnam War which helped to bring our soldiers, doctors, and nurses home. I burned my bra so that women could have abortions and be offered birth control. I educated myself about Affirmative Action and voted for it. I was there when VRA was passed. I want all if that to return but if we have a fight on our hands, fight we must!
Thank you for being there in those moments. I began with the protests in Durham NC in the early sixties; been doing what I can since......
Thank you! I am formerly from NC and left after high school to go to DC. Best experience of my life. Took my daughters in 2019 back there for the Women’s March. They appreciated the area so much. Even went to Congress for a day. All of the R’s looked like “white cotton-heads”, according to my kids. 😃
"white cotton-heads"-- sometimes kids say such accurate things!
There are FOUR women on the SCOTUS, Marlene. Not ALL women can be trusted.
Well three of them can!
Terrifying is the word for today. Between Little Mike Johnson and the Supreme Court decision to hear Trump's immunity claim, I feel totally disheartened. It's almost impossible to maintain faith in our rule of law.
Yes. Terrifying. The rule of law is slowly being whittled away. The US is becoming a billionaire run banana republic!!!
As Groucho Marx sang in Duck Soup: "if you think this country's bad off, now just wait 'til I get through with it".
I disagree. The fix is clearly in at the most corrupt Court in our history. This Court is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the Republican Party and the Federalist Society and they no longer care who knows it. We can thank Garland for dragging his feet on prosecuting Trump, but of course Garland is Federalist Society and is a plant who snookered Biden into appointing him. Biden should fire Garland today and give us an AG with a commitment to the rule of law - not that the rule of law is going to matter after the Extremes get done with it. I also note the fact that the DC Circuit Court ruling that the Extremes just pissed on was the product of three female judges, and we know how the fascists on this court feel about uppity women.
I am terrified, in despair and very close to being utterly defeated, and I'm too old and too poor to get out of this horrible country. All we can do is try to fight back, because I'm damned if I'm going to allow myself to be put in a concentration camp.
I will not leave the US. This is my home.
I thought this was my home. Now I know that I won't be welcome here once the monsters take over. But it doesn't matter since I have no way to get out.
Where to.go, where to go, me and my little black cat in our silver Hyundai. And she hates to ride in the car.
There's nowhere to go that's safe. The right is taking over across the globe.
I used to think that being older was better. Now I'm not so sure.
I'm not so sure either. I'm 74, and after surviving Nixon and Bush I did not expect to spend my last years in a fascist hellhole. Too old now to hide out in the mountains like members of the French Resistance.
Let's see what happens when push comes to shove!
Wait, you live somewhere so awful, in the United States, that one crackpot decision from the SCOTUS - even if Trump gets shellacked in the election, or to make it easier to make your case, if he wins - is therefore a "fascist hellhole," where no one will organize to fight back, really?
I admit I live in a city that made headlines for months fighting back in 2020, but I can't believe this place is THAT singular!
Are you sure you aren't overreacting, Linda?
Read the history of the Weimar Republic. No, I am not overreacting. This is a terrible country full of ignorant assholes.
I appreciate your point of view Mr. Trumbull but please explain how people can “organize to fight back”. As an anti Vietnam war activist I tried that in 1968 and when I got a draft notice at 24 years of age I went to Canada. I ultimately succumbed to legal and family pressure and reported for induction. There was no way out for me.
Uruguay
Yes!
Norway, for me.
It's rural Wales for me.
Canada
It's a horror show. Living in Canada is too close.
It's close but at least you're not here. I enquired about moving to Canada but was told that I did not fit the requirements.
Did they tell you what the requirements were?
Yes. I don't have enough money and I'm too old to work, being 74 and retired.
Thank you. I would be in that same boat.
That boat's about to get really crowded.
Yes, these are the sad facts that come out when disgruntled Americans really check into "moving to Canada."
Canada will have to build a wall. Millions of us will want OUT and they're not prepared to accept us, any more than we accept all the Latin Americans we helped impoverish.
Lucian, I just wrote this letter to an old college friend which I think applies to what you wrote and then some...
______ I do not gainsay what you have written to me. Biden is not as sharp as he once was, like all old men over eighty, he has lost some but still functions quite well. I am aware of those you discussed former staffers for Obama. None of them, none said he was no longer capable of governing. And NONE of them are working in the White House at present. They are outsiders giving their views.
I wish Biden had done as he said he would, be a one term president. But he has not and is running against Trump.
What I think you do not understand nor does your wonderful, lovely wife is why I am so adamant, so horrified about this election and why I write to you! Please read the following and I hope you will then understand:
I studied extensively Germany in the 1930s and wrote on the translated diaries, newspapers in a long paper. Sadly and frighteningly, what happened there is exactly what is happening in America. The educated, the "decent" common German, the professionals, looked the other way as dear leader took over the media, the courts, the educational system, and the military. They looked the other way as the scapegoats were blamed and then eliminated. The gypsies, the Jews, the mentally deficient, the communists, all those who disagreed with Der Fuhrer. In other words, to get those things they wanted, to "make Germany great again," it no longer mattered that their leader was a pathological liar, was a criminal, was an insurrectionist, actually said the ugly things he was going to do. And as Krystal Nacht and one horror after another happened, they looked the other way.
It was more important that they got the "things" they wanted.
In 1929 most people thought Hitler was a clown, a joke, but they were sure he could be controlled. And in Germany those were professionals like the judges, the engineers, accountants, professors, biologists, scientists as well as "the common" German. Yep, they got what they wanted as they looked the other way. And how did that work out for them in the end?
I decided that unlike those Germans who looked the other way, in the US as MAGA takes over, I had to stand up. And yes, I hope the intelligent Americans will see this evil. I might fail but I will be damned if I "look the other way" just to get some "things" I want. And when Trump tells us he is immune from all our laws, can do anything he wants as president, if that does not scare you, I do not then understand you. Since I am a Christian, I know Trump stands for everything Jesus told us not to do. Love was the center for Christ. Can any Christian look at Trump and say, "he is one of us?!?!?" When Trump was asked what acts of his life he had asked forgiveness of God, he answered, "I have never done anything wrong, why would I have to ask for forgiveness?"
This is a human who has cheated on all of his three wives, was caught on tape bragging about grabbing women by the pussy cause they let you when you are a star. This is a "business man" who has destroyed the little guy in business throughout his life. I sent you the true story of one person I know through ....... who Trump destroyed. He did that to literally hundreds!! This is a criminal who even gathered the mob, incited them, sent them to the Capital to stop the legal voting, they invaded, he did nothing for hours, then when he saw his insurrection failed, he told them to go home, told them he was proud of them, he loved them. OMG.
This is a man who denigrates our veterans, mocks them, mocked John McCain and his bravery.
Yes, , I hope and pray that the intelligent voter will not "look the other way." That might be a forlorn hope and a wasted prayer on you and those professional people you know who "look the other way" but I fervently feel we must stand up in the face of this evil.
Just moments ago SCOTUS, now in control of MAGA, will now decide if a president is immune from the law. They will hear the case on April 22rd. That pretty much insures there will be no trial before the election in November. Just like Hitler did with the courts in Germany, moved all decisions until he controlled Germany. Then all cases were dismissed. Fact.
Thank you for sharing the letter you wrote to your friend. We are in very scary times.
I can't think of anyone with the possible exception of Adolph himself, who isn't rolling in his/her grave right now.
This letter is one for the ages. Thank you.
I also watched Nicole Wallace today, and came away very discouraged. I do feel like the far right justices know they can’t grant absolute immunity, but the next best thing is to run the clock and delay any chance of prosecution until after the election. You know . . . . the election the maga says they will not allow a Democrat to win no matter what. This makes me sick to my stomach, and beyond angry.
Terrifying indeed, Lucian. I’m a bit stunned actually. Given the thoroughness of the DC Appeals Court’s brief, it seemed likely that SCOTUS would uphold it. I should have known better. As you say, the fix isn’t in yet for sure, but increasingly it’s looking likely. If that’s the case SCOTUS is corrupted and our democracy is on the verge of ending.
Yet again, we the people must save ourselves by voting against Trump returning to the White House. There looks to be no other way to stop a second Trump term at this point.
This hasn't happened overnight. The Federalists and Dominionists have been beavering away at this for decades.
I have been warning about the Christian Dominionists for decades-- mostly to deaf ears-- liberal friends who thought I was over-reacting to a ridiculous degree, while others said I was an anti-religious bigot.
In the middle 80's I had a friend who had me over to her house one evening. She had the "left behind" series of books on her coffee table. She kept insisting to me that they were all true. I left and never went back.
I went to a Billy Graham crusade event in the mid eighties, out of curiosity. It felt like a testosterone fueled Nazi rally.
The weird sexual vibe was unexpected and scary at the time.
I wish the oddball Xtian fundies would focus more on renovating their homes, like other self respecting seniors.
Demolishing and renovating an entire country's political, religious and judicial systems, is so out of bounds!
With "the weird sexual vibe' are you saying that the crowd received all his shouted certainties as a quasi sexual experience?
You know how some people are turned on by war, aggression, it was like that. There was nothing, calm, peaceful or loving there.
Im a proud anti religious bigot.
Since i was 14..
I gave up in the wooden nickel tooth fairy
I am bigoted against parasitic offshoots of traditional religion but am somewhat religious myself. As long as there is a firm separation between church and state, and nobody is hurting anyone else, religion can be a gel that holds a society together and buttresses humanistic values. But I so get your sentiment, because, yep, it sure seems like a net negative right now!
Me too. I've lost a few friends to the MAGA rabbit hole, people who really do know better but whose brains broke somewhere along the way.
And the Catholic Fundies are right there in cahoots!! Do you see the 'sacred heart of jesus' behind Bannon's head??? Include Alito, Coney Barrett, Flynn, Barr, & Kavanaugh and many others.
Judith,
American Liberals think (or used to think) in terms of open democratic systems. Problems that arose or might arise were thought to be amenable to correction, along those lines.
They dismissed the idea that outside groups or individuals feeding on and undermining those systems could gain control.
Canadians, in general, have a very dim view of the American political system. That might give us an edge on seeing events unfolding in the US in a slightly different way.
We're less inclined to throw up our hands and say, "Oh that could never happen in the US" Most of us think anything is possible, politically, in the US.
You’re right, of course. It’s been a long-term project for them.
An excellent history of the American right: Before the Storm, by Rick Perlstein. There is nothing new under the sun.
I am really shocked that they agreed to hear this ludicrous appeal. If immunity is conferred to Trump in this case, they really will have overturned 248 years of resistance to monarchy. It will be game over.
The only remedy would be this: Trump soundly and solidly defeated at the ballot box. And then, President Biden and the Congress expand the Court and (if Trump is successful in arguing for immunity) hand down a decision soundly rejecting presidential immunity.
If that doesn't happen, we have lost everything people have fought and died for since 1776.
“When it is laid down as a maxim that a King can do no wrong, it places him in a state of similar security with that of idiots and persons insane, and responsibility is out of the question with respect to himself.”
– Thomas Paine, The Rights of Man, Conclusion (1791-2)
The American Revolution turns out to be a sham and a waste of time. I'd rather we stuck with King George III than wind up in a Trump dynasty despotism.
This is devastating, but didn’t surprise me. When SCOTUS refused to hear the immunity case when Jack Smith asked to bypass the Appeals court it wreaked of delay. It’s obvious there are six members of SCOTUS that are working for Leonard Leo, Harlan Crowe, Federalist Society, Heritage Foundation, etc, etc etc, and not we the people. The fascist oligarchs are getting closer to complete rule. Our democracy is not lost yet if we work to get the information out and enough people vote blue like our life depends on it. Because it does.
We can vote blue until we are blue in the face, but people, trump will TAKE THE WIN! And all we can do is sit and cry!! Because this game is being played over our little bitty heads and we cant do anything to stop it. ITS SO HORRIBLE.
I get it Suzanne. I feel like sitting and crying too. But I can’t give up. We have to keep working. No one is going to save our Democracy but us.
"Never give up. Never surrender."
Yes, it has come to this, quoting parody movies to make a real life serious point.
Hope springs eternal....
I hope a miracle saves us from finding ourselves living in Trumpistan this time next year.
Biden should authorize Seal Team six to deep six thump
I’d wait until the day after the decision. Could cancel the election at the same time and formally disband the Republican Party. Confiscate the assets of everyone in the Federalist Society. Arrest and deport to Russia every elected Republican official. All legal, amirite?
I’m voting for you!
ME TOO!!! Send that on to the proper authorities!!!
Sounds like a plan!
Perfect!
There won't be a decision though. They'll just run out the clock. If they didn't and actually had the balls to decide the prez was immune, Biden might actual use the decision and they won't risk that.
The election will be the decision. If Trump wins, game over. If Biden wins, then what?
Where's Lee Harvey Oswald when we REALLY NEED him???
Lee's still working for the CIA
Kept alive thru stem cell research and maybe deep freeze.
Too soon...
Exactly as he as a sitting president is above the law.
Heartsick and full of despair. SO painful to watch our nation being intentionally destroyed.
Reading SCOTUS referred to as "a gaggle of stary-eyed authoritarian moonies to the highest court in the land" made my day.
As to the case, itself, by me it's a toss-up. The fixed judges might vote to support Trump (and still be outnumbered) or ... knowing the heat is on, do the right thing to try to right their crooked ship to some degree.
I think they know the best way to help the orange cheeto is to give him as many delays as possible.
Reading through all these “it's over, America is done” comments is almost as depressing as the moonies agreeing to hear the case. So thanks for your small note of optimism!
Seems likely to me that taking the case is a fig leaf for their “fucking Federalist Society” overlords. They know they can't grant immunity without literally blowing up the entire republic, so they're offering a delay as a dodge.
Maybe Even the fucking Federalist Society can see how this ends - out of control chaos - markets tanking and their holdings up in smoke?
As far as I know bribery is still illegal. DOJ could prosecute both Thomas and Alito as bribees and Crow or whomever else is guilty as the bribers. But it won’t because DOJ is in on it.
Big money wants a Repub, any Repub that can force the others to follow along.
No matter how it goes, this is going to be the ugliest most damaging year in American history, domestically and internationally.
Worse than 1968...started with the Pueblo capture by North Korea, assassinations of MLK and RFK, and to top off the Horror show, Nixon elected POTUS.
Well, if Trump feels he has total immunity and could order Seal Team 6 to do his bidding, then I think Biden should consider making a phone call.
Yup. You feel safe in Canada right now? We'll suffer terribly, either by imitation or through intimidation if this plays out as I fear it will.