92 Comments

Things are never going to get better in God's waiting room. I have two sets of friends in the Tampa area who are begging my wife, daughter and I to move there. Never in a thousand years. I can't live with the kind of politics practiced there. DeSantis, Scott, Rubio, Gaetz...no fuckin' way.

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I concur, Michael. Scott, Rubio, & Desantis are but three reasons why my wife and I (both life-long Floridians) moved out of the state a few years ago. A couple of other reasons for leaving are rampant, out-of-control development and a whole lot of very unpleasant people moving into the state.

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That too. Way too much development, a lot of it substandard and more and more people of The Villages ilk for my taste. There are better, less sweaty places to live.

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March 18, 2023
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I think it attracts a type. Doesn’t matter where they’re from. Big City-ness just makes them louder. I can’t live with old people. And I’m 71. I don’t think like them at all.

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There is a retirement community near us in CA. My husband has always said he would not move there because there’s too many old people. He’s 76 and I am 71. We will live and die in our house of 47 years, much to the dismay of younger folks.

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I'm 71 going on 72. Retirement is not in the picture. ;-)

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March 18, 2023
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Wise choice for you and your wife!

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a very surprising bit of information I only discovered a few years back:

the so-called baby Boomer generation (which I always assumed dated from just after the war till about 1960) actually began in 1943.

I know, I know...I was also amazed.

but, assuming this is accurate (I never looked for a second source), you're actually a Boomer.

and anyway, aren't all babies born as a direct result of WWII circumstances (like, for example, me) considered "war babies?" I sure think of myself as one, since without the war, the likelihood of my Bronx dad and Loosiana mom getting together is precisely zero.

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Really, TC? Most people I've known living and working in NYC most of my life have moved to distant states or countries. None would have considered moving to the Villages or a place like it. Judging by their political proclivities I've always assumed residents there were retired midwesterners or rednecks, never New Yorkers. I attended a luncheon a few years ago with a couple hundred women I went to school with in the Ohio Valley. Almost every one I talked with mentioned a second home in Florida, although none the Villages.

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The Villages is heaven for certain types. I have several HS classmates who retired there. I pretty much left them all behind when I graduated. Through the “magic” of Facebook I see something posted by them on occasion. They’re living in the right place. Stay there.

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March 19, 2023
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March 19, 2023
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what I've always found really disconcerting is how right-wing the NYFD guys are. nothing about the NYPD's stupidity could ever surprise me, but firemen are the real deal. cops are always talking about "putting their lives on the line every day" (and when I was writing briefs for their retirement pensions, I found out that cops will fill out accident reports for fucking paper cuts), but statistically, that's bullshit. firefighters' job description includes constant danger (and they NEVER fill out accident reports). I've also been in a fire or two and those guys will actually risk their lives for yours when it comes down to it.

therefore, I suppose I tend to idealize them. but I still don't quite get it.

from what I hear about The Villages, it surprises me that retired cops and firefighters can afford to live there. unless, of course, they were OFFICERS, in which case the corrupt system exists to reward them for being assholes.

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Granted, I'm rarely on Staten Island. I know Long Island better and NYPD and FDNY feel wall to wall. …

I'm missing our resident Florida expert, Leigh van Lydegraf. Many weeks since his last comment. … Lucian?

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Lived some of my youth there and loved it, but that Florida is gone now. I will never go back - - - I want to remember Florida the way it was.

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Can't wait to see the Selma rewrite; Sunday stroll across the Pettus Bridge, people walking their happy dogs, it was such hot day kindly policeman splashed people with cool water...

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Prolly been written by those who pen Alternative History.

The past 6yrs found the GOP. the Trump WH, FNC, AM-TALK, and conservative media platforms harvest 4 and 8chan for stories. It wouldn't be a stretch to see them next dig into the world of Alternative History.

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Yes, I was thinking about the 9-11 Rewrite-A few Arabic malcontents boarded several planes to show a misguided nationalism for their home countries to the world.The planes malfunctioned with some loss of life.

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Hit Florida in the pocketbook. Encourage students to go to college outside the state. Start an "underground" network to furnish real books to students. Any other ideas to combat this ****?

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Not going to spend a nickel of my tourist cash in that shithole. Same goes for Texas, Wyoming, SC and the rest of the goober states

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By the time DeFascist is done, no FL HS grad will be prepared to attend a college outside Floriduh, and even then, only capable of attending one of the state schools that he has also dumbed down.

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The African American Policy Forum is doing good work in this area (and several other areas -- I'm an enthusiastic supporter). Check out their "From Freedom Rider to Freedom Reader" and "Freedom to Learn" initiatives. "Freedom Rider to Freedom Reader" was a cross-country bus tour! https://www.aapf.org/ and http://booksunbanned.org/

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I agree. Tell people to boycott Disney world and other attractions.

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In 1972, I was part of a college tour group that went to Prague, Leningrad (now Saint Petersburg), Kiev and Moscow. A few students from California smuggled in books including The Bible and Dr Zhivago. Maybe that will have to be a thing for Florida and other extreme Red places in the near future.

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And isn’t that just pathetic?? In the USA, books have to smuggled in! 🤬

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March 19, 2023
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Well, underground networks like Jane helped women get abortions before Roe, so it could happen. The Jane women learned how to *perform* abortions -- they were in Chicago. (Anyone not familiar with the history of Jane can check out Laura Kaplan's excellent _The Story of Jane,_ first published in the mid-1990s but reprinted last fall with some new material.)

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Campaign to keep the the snowbirds from spending the winter in Florida.

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I agree. I have chosen Florida along with Texas, Georgia, South Carolina and a few others as states where I will not spend my money .I have said this before and will say it again. I would choose Ohio as another such place but I live here. Sigh.

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March 18, 2023
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How should we do that? Any suggestions? Contact the state education association? PTAs?

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Desantis is well along in turning my former home state into a Taliban-like dictatorship. I'm sure that birth control will soon be forbidden and burkas will be required attire for women (unless they are members of the Repugnant party).

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March 18, 2023
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Ginni Thomas—perfect example

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That last version makes it like an everyday incident, nothing to do with discrimination - a territorial conflict you might say. If this man becomes president every school in America will be taught this way as if racism never existed, Next line of attack will be slavery itself, they were just tourists from Africa..

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"Next line of attack will be slavery itself, they were just tourists from Africa.."

QOTD (Quote Of The Day)

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They were all stowaways and illegal immigrants! So the kindly landowners had to take them into protective custody until such time as they could pay their debt to society and pay for a return ticket.

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Well-played. The 2nd order of effect of Lucian's thoughts and words are they inspire so many to up their own which in turn leads to the 3rd order of effect and on and on as opposed to the lazy-arse echo chamber found in conservative media. Said another way, the red laced boot Stormfronters have more game than conservative media.

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I'm honored, Shadowcloud :)

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My nod to you, Good Man. Respect.

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Or they were well-paid employees who could leave for a better job whenever they wished.

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Y'all crackin' me up.

Ds/libs/lefties and the woke have no qualms making a point with humor, including self-deprecating. Beats crying most of the time

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Yes, true, Shadowcloud, the Republicans are devoid of humor. Impossible to laugh at themselves.

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Here is what most of us have difficulty acceptihg. This kind of revisionism is more than accepted by a large segment of Florida residents. It would seem they are more than OK with living in an alternate reality universe so long as they can get court time for pickleball.

Democracy without a Constitution to protect liberties and rights can become an autocracy. Floridians seem to be OK with it.

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Until their condos start collapsing

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That's fine. They know the gubmint will bail them out.

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How do we effectively combat this? Along with the Federalist BS coming to every town USA??

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Combat darkness with light. By Not stopping to speak out. I likely piss off my "friends" all the time, but I will not be silent.

We must not be silent.

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I used to believe that buried in the human psyche there are redeeming qualities that are worth exploring and bringing to the surface. I've given up on that idea now that I've seen what happened in Florida over the past several decades. I now see Florida as the place where the mind and the soul go to die, long before the body gives up the ghost. I had a sense of that many years ago when my family would go down to South Florida to visit with my wife's parents in one of those innumerable retirement communities where transplanted Northerners would lounge by the pool and complain about how their grown children would never call them, or come to visit, or the thousand and one things that seemed to irritate them, such as so-and-so's grandchildren were making too much noise in the pool. I couldn't take it. After one or two trips, I held down the fort in Massachusetts for the two weeks or so that my family went down to visit her parents and relatives there, and never for a moment that I regret my decision to stay in cold, gray Massachusetts. There was just something about the place that set my teeth on edge. It seemed that Florida was just one giant trailer park, dotted here and there with gated communities of overpriced bungalow houses. Ugh!

Florida politics followed that trend line, with its bitterness and resentments become ever more strident over the years. Now, with Ron DeSantis as their governor, presidential wannabe as Trump lite, it is apparent to me that Florida is also the place where the intellect goes to die. What we are seeing is a society in decay, rotting away from the inside out.

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DeSantis is t-Rump HEAVY— tRump on steroids, t-rump with a brain and a mission he actually believes in. He is MUCH more dangerous than t-Rump!

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I wouldn't disagree with you on that.The sad part is that Florida voters are brainwashed by his nonsense.

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Think about flood insurance. It might soon be unavailable. Florida doesn’t like federal government but they are the state most exposed to catastrophic consequences.

So naturally trans gender people must be the greatest concern.

Don’t say gay don’t say slave don’t say flood insurance. Lying is easy.

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March 18, 2023
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I would miss Key West (always wanted to visit) and that wacky park where they have "mermaid" shows.

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People of ordinary means used to be able to live in Key West and the town was magical. I doubt either is true now.

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You are correct. Neither is true today. It has become bachelor/and bachelorette party heaven...even destination wedding location. Decided that this year was our farewell tour. It’s just too sanitized. It’s edge is gone.

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That is indeed sad. Children of the tin-canners, as locals back.when called the honeymooners who drove into town, cars still dragging wedding noise-makers.

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Oh, how sad. I think (thought) of it as a laid-back, faintly cantankerous, rum-soaked offshoot of the Caribees, with Hemingway cats and seafood feasts. "Conch Republic," I admire that. But then, I've also read about how the cruise lines flood the city with day trippers and that skyrocketing housing costs are changing the makeup of the local population. I guess it's another place whose time has passed. All I would find today is a hollow facade. Too bad.... I do have an old friend who has lived there for years, works as a DJ at a "Gentleman's Club," so the seedy side is still there. But that's not what I was after.

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It used to be like that—not that I knew it as a resident, but friends were. When I spent time there, mid-'60s, the tipping was under way. Having lived in a similarly legendary NYC district since college, I recognize the process. No doubt the town looks pretty much the same but is quite different behind the gingerbread. All I really know about it now is what I read, same as you. Best stick with the old memoirs and movies, fiction and fantasies, I guess.

Toby Thompson, who outed the 'Girl from the North Country' next wrote a book about land's end towns like Key West and Provincetown. I never read it, but I imagine he dug up more stuff worth reading. Hmmm. I didn't dream that, but no internet bibliography ever heard of the follow-up book. The NYT review was lukewarm. Maybe Toby withdrew it? Odd.

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Here’s how Florida would teach young students about the “Freedom Riders” of the early 60’s.

Many years ago the Supreme Court took away our right to hang out with whoever we wanted to. Particularly on buses. Then some smarty-pants Yankees decided to ride buses down to Florida and Georgia and Mississippi and other great places like that. They took buses to tell other people what to do. But, those good people along the way in the southern states did not like this. They took a stand. Yes, they did. When those big buses full of Yankees stopped, the people explained to the riders that everyone was happy down here. “We all don’t need other folks coming down here and telling us what to do,” said one fine strapping young lad waving the Stars and Bars and drinking a Yoo-hoo. “Or take away our Freedom!” said another brave man as he adjusted his hood. And it was southern Patriots like those who pointed out to the riders that the buses were not very safe. “Look!” one Hero of the South, yelled out. “Your bus is on fire!!!” [See Photo below]. “This is a bad bus. Terrible. Follow me. I will lead you out.” And, he did, and nobody was hurt. Most of those buses were no good. They were probably made in China. Or Albany.

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“And we brought out our firehoses to cool them off and our therapy dogs to cuddle.” Somehow four of them Yankees ended up dayed. Warn’t our fault.”

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Shared.

Perhaps someday certain people will get their heads out of their asses and own up to the revisionist history that they want the future to see. (is that fair? Are DeSantis et al even human?)

What we all see are racists and pathological egotist, individuals with delusions of grandeur and and an obsession with power at any cost. DANGEROUS SCUMBAGS.

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Due to present conditions, the Sunshine State could be renamed the Darkest State. Following Orban/Assad/Erdogan, rename it Flungary, Flyria or Flurkey. I spent several years there, thinking that I was typing one finger over. I never fit in and was delighted once I saw it in the rearview mirror.

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😆😆😆😆😆

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I love your alternate names for Florida!!!

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White-washing history, revisionist cover-up, has a long and inglorious tradition. And if in fact “history is written by the victors”, DeSantos and his lackeys are a tad premature in their efforts.

Keep following up on their shenanigans and don’t discount the importance of free speech!

You have a voice, a vote, and a mind. Don’t underestimate to power of these to shape the future. You have only to look around and maintain your integrity. Sometimes being a witness makes all the difference.

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Really interesting how DeSantis wants to whitewash the real story. His grandparents all came from southern Italy during the Italian diaspora at the turn of the 20th century when Italians, particularly those from the south were not considered white and were treated with contempt because they were dark skinned. They were actually referred to as "colored" and denied many of the rights "white" people enjoyed. He may have a Harvard law degree but he either knows nothing about American institutional racism or pretends it doesn't exist. Had he immigrated here in 1910, Harvard would never have been on his resume.

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Bullshit. sells for a while. People generally ignore the crazies on the school board until things get especially nasty. The 1950s saw a lot of segregation.talk

and after a few years the hard right got the boot and moderates took over. For some reason every few decades the hard left or hard right get control but they always defeat themselves

DeSantis is an ugly wave but he will in due time discredit himself.

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I hope it happens soon.

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Florida reminds me of two movies. One is Footloose where the entire community is full of self righteous Christian assholes. The other is an early scene from Field of Dreams where the community is having a meeting to discuss banning books. Prescient? Happened then and continues now.

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